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#51 2020-04-27 14:55

q4osteam
Q4OS Team
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Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

It's updated automatically from repositories.

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#52 2020-04-27 15:10

OldRunner
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Registered: 2020-04-11
Posts: 35

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

q4osteam wrote:

It's updated automatically from repositories.

Good.
No need to dance with tambourines again :-)

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#53 2020-04-28 17:40

Ahmet2677
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Registered: 2020-04-28
Posts: 7

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

q4osteam wrote:

It's updated automatically from repositories.

I tried a lot of linux. Honestly the fastest is q4os.
We want the speed from you and it's your difference.
Debian or Ubuntu are the fastest and error-free whichever one we just want. Currently i am using with wondows q4os better than windows and MACOS. thank for all of them.

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#54 2020-04-28 18:42

Ahmet2677
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Registered: 2020-04-28
Posts: 7

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

I dont know debian better than Ubuntu or not. We only want speed and error free. ?

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#55 2020-05-07 19:37

q4osteam
Q4OS Team
Registered: 2015-12-06
Posts: 3,523
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Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

An updated image "ubuntu-quark-20.04-x64-testing.r8.iso" is available for download from https://sourceforge.net/projects/ubuntu … s/testing/

Trinity repositories and all its software are not included by default, however we have enabled optional installation of the Trinity desktop using Desktop profiler tool. It can add needed repositories and install the Trinity desktop on explicit request.

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#56 2020-05-08 07:09

OldRunner
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Registered: 2020-04-11
Posts: 35

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Well, we will update and see how it will work

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#57 2020-05-08 09:44

macadoum
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Registered: 2020-05-08
Posts: 1

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Will it be possible in the future to install Quark with a Windows Installer like it is possible for Q4OS ?

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#58 2020-05-08 09:51

q4osteam
Q4OS Team
Registered: 2015-12-06
Posts: 3,523
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Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

@macadoum
Yes, we would like to include it.

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#59 2020-05-08 15:00

OldRunner
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Registered: 2020-04-11
Posts: 35

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

System: Kernel: 5.4.0-29-generic x86_64 bits: 64
           Desktop: KDE Plasma 5.18.4 Distro: Q4OS 4.20.04-0.0-n1-uqk

This is after today's update.

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#60 2020-05-08 15:34

q4osteam
Q4OS Team
Registered: 2015-12-06
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Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

@OldRunner
Correct

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#61 2020-05-26 13:02

HAL_2000
Member
Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Hello Q4OS Team, you might recall my post from the feature request forum. You had mentioned an experimental distribution called Quark, which to my understanding was a Q4OS, based on Ubuntu.

I am fairly new to Linux, but over the last several months, have been loading and testing a variety of distributions who all claim to revive older, 32-bit, low RAM hardware.

Thus far, I have liked LXLE and Linux Lite, but for speed and theming (e.g. Windows look), you've edged the others out.


The biggest shortcoming of Q4OS was apparent lack of driver support.

Ubuntu -based distros recognized wireless cards, webcams, video and sound cards without a hitch.

But Windows  theming the icons and taskbar of distros like Lubuntu, Linux Lite, and LXLE were difficult for someone new to Linux.


Might I suggest a distro tailor-made for those new to Linux? Q4OS is a very good start.

The Windows -theme-able XPQ4 is excellently done and easily implemented.

But I am sure you would be disappointed if I only wrote good things about your distro.

You (Q4OS Team & Dai-trying) invited me to try out your Ubuntu -based Quark.


I would love to but I am limited by my mission. I am trying to revive a large inventory of older 32-bit machines for gifting to those who cannot otherwise afford a machine. (Kids, mom's, vets, etc...).

I've been doing this for years and about 200 machines have found extended life and new homes. XP and Windows 7 can no longer be used for this purpose, both being outdated and in some instances, unable to work with the Internet.


My donees are generally fairly computer illiterate, which makes using Linux in its raw form difficult. Familiar Windows themes, icons, Start button and task bar are important to them, along with a general functioning that they learned in school or other venues. This assists in easing any confusion they might have.

I did take a look at the Source forge download page for Quark. It appears to be for 64-bit architecture.


Do you have a 32 bit version, which is also Ubuntu -based?


Lastly, my recipients would probably not know their way around the terminal, being too confused, intimidated or annoyed to even try.


These same potential Windows refugees could likely use a GUI in lieu of a terminal (even if that terminal-GUI only covered the basics.) I understand ROX is a GUI desktop environment used in AntiX that also has a very small RAM footprint.


In short, I am wondering if you have an existing distro, or one in development, that matches the following specifications:

- Small, fast OS, supporting low-RAM, 32-bit architecture;

- Windows theme-able;

- good, easily-implemented driver support (wireless, sound, video, printers, webcams);

- Extremely user friendly and geared to potential Converts from Windows; and perhaps;

- A GUI in lieu of most Terminal functions ("ROX?").

Such a distro could very well trigger a migration from a wealth of users, unhappy with Windows 8 and 10.


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#62 2020-05-26 17:52

OldRunner
Member
Registered: 2020-04-11
Posts: 35

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Hi,HAL_2000
Why don't you try this one - Puppy Linux?

http://puppylinux.com/

Last edited by OldRunner (2020-05-26 17:54)

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#63 2020-05-27 10:44

HAL_2000
Member
Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Thanks OldRunner.  I took a quick look at that page and found this line interesting: “Linux distro for Windows refugee”.

Other encouraging items: initial iterations of Puppy Linux were coded to work nicely with older, less powerful hardware. The use of VLC, Palemoon and Rox (something I'd like to know more about).

But the FAQ and history page seemed long on puppy and woof references and short of specifics.

How can one system be based on Ubuntu, Debian and Slack?

From what I gathered, Puppy is a modular system that does not follow the periodic release paradigm of other distros. If one version of Puppy works they simply keep it. Others make variations on the main theme and keep those.

You'll forgive me if I'm still a tad unclear exactly what Puppy *is*

Perhaps it would be more concise to ask whether it could do all those things I asked above:


- small, light, fast distribution that works nicely on laptops with 1 gig RAM with perhaps a 1.6 GHz CPU (often, these are Centrino / Pentium-M). Desktops are generally Pentium 4's running 2.8 GHz or faster, perhaps an equivalent AMD system, all are 32-bit systems.

- I don't get more specific than that because I have a lot of older hardware.

- the targeted demographic are those who need a free computer. They may have familiarity with Windows XP, Windows 7 or even older Apple / Mac. Most recently, I am getting requests from a 3rd grade class in Central America, where XP still is not outdated.

- theme-able to resemble Windows icons, taskbar, Start button and menus.

- not rely heavily upon CLI as much a GUI.

- the OS / desktop must be easily understood and as intuitive as possible, because it cannot be assumed that highly competent IT staff will on hand.

- the OS must be able to recognize and install drivers for add-on cards and peripherals, preferably automatically or with little specialized effort required.

Those are the things I'd like to know about any Linux distro.

I thought I had found the answer in Q4OS in its XPQ4 form, but lack of driver support is a problem.


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#64 2020-05-27 12:55

bin
Member
From: U.K.
Registered: 2016-01-28
Posts: 1,148

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

HAL_2000 wrote:

........I thought I had found the answer in Q4OS in its XPQ4 form, but lack of driver support is a problem.

Reading your other posts on this topic I think there are a few points that stand out - but this one is the real killer.

Right now you could try to install Windows 10 on a 15 year old laptop and it would fail - been there, done that! OK it may sort of work on some but it may not depending on proprietary drivers.

Same problem applies to Linux and old hardware - but with a few extra gotchas.

Witness your questions regarding and old webcam that only ever had limited support under linux to start with....

If you are going to do this then you need to establish a baseline of stuff that will behave as you hope. Moreover you are the one who is going to be supporting all these people so you need to up your skills to do so.

In general, Dell and HP/Compaq kit will behave well even going back in time but it's the 32bit that is going to be an issue long term. Don't forget that just because a machine had 32 bit Windows doesn't mean it's a 32 bit machine, you need to check the hardware specifically. Printers are usually not too much of a problem - again HP are well supported, but older combined printer scanner machines can be an issue - you may only get partial functionality.

Q4OS TDE is a very lightweight distribution - I had it down to ticking over at 173mb of RAM on an old Dell 1501 laptop. It does meet you needs for UI customisation - and I understand your urge to maintain a UI that is at least familiar. ROX is an interesting world but would not fit the bill in any meaningful way.

When it comes to Terminal and GUI, Linux is very like Windows 3.1 used to be - you had DOS and then a pretty GUI running on top. Sometimes there is no GUI tool, but these days that doesn't happen too often. It is not hard to actually write a little file that just needs a double-click to activate a command line script so the terminal is hidden to the user.

the OS must be able to recognize and install drivers for add-on cards and peripherals, preferably automatically or with little specialized effort required.

If there are drivers in the kernel it will just work - if there are not then you have to sort it yourself which can be a challenge. Any potential hardware purchase needs to be checked via your favourite search engine to see if it does work on current linux.

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#65 2020-05-27 14:50

OldRunner
Member
Registered: 2020-04-11
Posts: 35

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

HAL_2000 wrote:

You'll forgive me if I'm still a tad unclear exactly what Puppy *is*

Perhaps it would be more concise to ask whether it could do all those things I asked above:


You'll never know until you try it yourself
The best way is to install, test, and decide for yourself whether it is worth it or not.

Last edited by OldRunner (2020-05-27 14:50)

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#66 2020-06-05 00:33

HAL_2000
Member
Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

@q4osteam,

I did take a look at the Source forge download page for Quark. It appears to be for 64-bit architecture.

Do you have a 32 bit version, which is also Ubuntu -based?


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#67 2020-06-05 09:10

q4osteam
Q4OS Team
Registered: 2015-12-06
Posts: 3,523
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Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Unfortunately, 32bit version is not available.

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#68 2020-06-06 07:10

HAL_2000
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Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Leider.  Sehr enttäuscht.

Danke, sowieso.


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#69 2020-06-06 07:16

HAL_2000
Member
Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

OldRunner wrote:
HAL_2000 wrote:

You'll forgive me if I'm still a tad unclear exactly what Puppy *is*

Perhaps it would be more concise to ask whether it could do all those things I asked above:


You'll never know until you try it yourself
The best way is to install, test, and decide for yourself whether it is worth it or not.

I've downloaded Puppy for 32 bit Intel.  I have a few IDE laptop drives.  What I can do is preserve my progress with Debian-based Q4OS by removing that HDD and putting in a fresh drive to try Puppy on, and then see how the installs compare.

I really do like Q4OS thus far, but the difficulty in loading device drivers is a real killer.  These machines are going to folks who are are complete neophytes. 

If it's this difficult for me, it will be a 30' wall for them. 

I'm still looking for a Distro that is PLAYSKOOL simple and user friendly.  Alas, Q4OS doesn't fill that checkbox.

Last edited by HAL_2000 (2020-06-06 07:18)


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#70 2020-06-06 14:33

wove
Member
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2019-12-31
Posts: 66

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

I am really not aware of any hardware or any OS that does not have its pain points. And of course the more pain points the device or OS has the less suitable it will be for giving to a new user. As far as I know every Thinkpad from the X61 on will run just about any OS you put on it without much trouble at all. These devices can be acquired on eBay for ~$35, and X220 which sells for ~$80 and will run everything from MacOS Catalina and Windows 10 to probably every Linux distro out there. A new Raspberry Pi can be had for about the same money and has many OSes supported right out of the box.

I have a couple machines that date from ~2005 and in honesty I would not consider giving them to a new user. I can make use of them and work around all the troubles associated with them, but a new user would simply run into insurmountable troubles very quickly and get no use out of them without extensive help. Q4OS supports just about anything that is worth supporting.

Wireless drivers a perhaps the biggest pain point on old hardware and the simplest solution is to purchase so cheap used USB wireless adaptors and just plug them into the USB port and leave them. Just about anything with a realtek chipset is supported out of the box. It will save you a lot of aggrevation and provide a fairly fool proof solution to the new user.

bill

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#71 2020-06-06 14:45

bin
Member
From: U.K.
Registered: 2016-01-28
Posts: 1,148

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

+1 - What he says!

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#72 2020-06-06 23:01

HAL_2000
Member
Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

wove wrote:

...the simplest solution is to purchase so cheap used USB wireless adaptors and just plug them into the USB port and leave them.

Bill,

I actually addressed this issue in another thread:

Certainly, it would be easier to simply just give up and rely upon the external USB WLAN dongle, but this is an educational exercise as much as anything else. At #7
https://www.q4os.org/forum/viewtopic.ph … 096#p18096

I am aware of hardware that is just too old.  I've been online with the machine in question and reading and posting responses with it, so it does work, certainly well enough as a free, basic machine.  My task is to have it set up to the point that it is ready to use (aside from perhaps putting in a network password) and nothing else needs to be done to put the machine into operation.

I've been doing this for about 15 years now with Windows-based machines. 

Each machine goes through an evaluation process and burn in period to make sure all systems are working, to include an on-line streaming music and video test.  Even before the OS is loaded, the HDD is SMART tested for errors.

Machines that bog on page views or choke when going online, get cycled out.

The mission here is to turn as much of this inventory of older machines into functioning, free, basic machines for kids, moms or vets to use, with an anticipated useful life of at least two, maybe three years (I've run into those who have received one of these machines and they have exceeded even that expected life span).

The reason that I am *here* is because there are over a half dozen distros of Linux which have been coded specifically to breath new life into older machines (and Q4OS seems to have done a nice job for this Sony Vaio PCG-FRV26).

The tradeoff is that now I have to learn Linux, an OS by Geeks and for Geeks, rather than Windows, which is an OS for the Masses, by Microsoft.  Earlier today, for instance, I set up a new laser printer on a moderately old Toshiba, running Win7 /sp1 64 bit.  All that was need was to hook the printer up to the USB port and allow the drivers to be automatically installed via internet connection. Exceedingly simple.

It's interesting to learn Linux and there are some very helpful posters here.  But it takes a great deal of work compared to Windows, and my specific mission in this thread is to get the PCMCIA wifi card to work with this machine. 

After that, and perhaps after installing Irfanview, and a PDF reader, the machine will be ready to ship to a 3rd grade class in Panama.

So it's kinda like learning to fish, rather than simply being given a fish. I need to learn Linux because there are more machines to prepare after this one.

Thanks for your insight.


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#73 2020-06-07 07:18

bin
Member
From: U.K.
Registered: 2016-01-28
Posts: 1,148

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

It's interesting to learn Linux and there are some very helpful posters here.  But it takes a great deal of work compared to Windows, and my specific mission in this thread is to get the PCMCIA wifi card to work with this machine.

Indeed it is, but ask yourself this. If that card stops working in Panama, what is the most likely replacement? A USB Dongle. So why present a potential future problem as part of the gift? Yes, getting PCMCIA cards to work can be interesting but not for your target.

After that, and perhaps after installing Irfanview, and a PDF reader, the machine will be ready to ship to a 3rd grade class in Panama.

IrfanView requires WINE. That brings another layer of complexity. If you really want to go that way then Picasa still works perfectly under WINE - I use it mainly for the Collage tool which is streets ahead of even Fotowall in linux. However, there are hundreds of image viewers for linux including native Trinity apps.
For PDF viewing kpdf-trinity of course integrates well with the system, there's also atril and evince. Here again think how people are used to doing stuff under Windows and make sure your tool choices mimic their expectations.
Printing brings a whole raft of fun - especially with Printer/Scanner machines. Many older models can be a real bear to get working with linux. HP machines are OK and will normally behave. Make sure as many printer related packages are installed as possible - so hplip plus practically anything in synaptic that mentions printer support. These days CUPS is pretty good but the standard CUPS interface in TDE may puzzle as it is quite old and uses browser interface to port 631. The built in tool in Control panel usually works OK
For scanning - maybe kooka-trinity or simple-scan
Think about how zip files need to be handled and there you're looking at ark-trinity.
Plugging in mobile phones to access images - can be fun! Different makes have their own quirks.
Care with email - many people use web mail these days and whilst Thunderbird is fine, if used with Gmail it then involves folks having to get into allowing less secure clients in their Gmail settings etc etc. For a simple life I'd suggest using Chrome as the browser and then Gmail is just easy. If web mail cannot be used then Tbird is the way to go.
For office software - well if you do need to go there I personally find LibreOffice to be awful. Softmaker do a free version of their software - there's a linux version which I have used for years and it provides a 100% MS compatible suite with the look and feel as well https://www.freeoffice.com/en/

Good luck with your mission!

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#74 2020-06-09 01:09

HAL_2000
Member
Registered: 2020-05-15
Posts: 44

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

As work picks up, there is less and less time that I can devote to learn the quirks of Q4OS, I may have to load LXLE (at least one earlier machine was loaded with LXLE and a B00merang Windows theme package), or to see how Puppy Linux recognizes and loads device drivers.

That being said, I'd like to master this challenge because I think I'm close to solving it for this machine (for instance, I've already managed sound and webcam drivers on the Vaio, so I know that success is possible). Incredibly, this old and heavy Vaio easily streams YouTube music and video on less than 1 gig of RAM memory (of course, everything else takes forever to respond if you open another tab or two).

One tech who owned the same model Vaio indicated that it was an odd bird, with a high end video card for a laptop, 2.8 GHz P4 processor, while other laptops and netbooks were about 1.6 GHz Pentium-M, Centrino or Atom processors, but only able to recognize less than one Gig of RAM. (It would boot with 2x 1GB DDR1 RAM modules, but not recognize anything above about 890 MB RAM).

To its credit, the machine goes online with PALEMOON and navigates with respectable speed, and in basic applications handles images and RTF documents without lagging or screen artifacts. 

The PCMCIA card is just about the last missing piece.

I texted my local Panama contact and he let me know that there is a tech on that end who can go about the business of maintaining the machines, perhaps installing Spanish language packages, modifying the settings for Spanish menus and keyboards, tutoring the young students and doing such things as installing a USB WLAN dongle if it comes to that.  My function is simply give them a start in the form of working hardware, which can be used out of the box, with minimal need for any modifications.

Now the rest of your post was really good, because it gives specific, useful programs or apps to be installed.

This is the sort of information that makes a forum a productive place to visit.

Thank you.

Last edited by HAL_2000 (2020-06-09 01:12)


[Dave] Open the pod bay doors, HAL....  [HAL] I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that. [BSOD]

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#75 2020-06-09 07:25

q4osteam
Q4OS Team
Registered: 2015-12-06
Posts: 3,523
Website

Re: Ubuntu Quark 20.04

Please keep this discussion about Ubuntu Quark. Unrelated posts may be removed.

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